Author Topic: Greg Stewart  (Read 5650 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline Ten Caat

  • Midfield Maestro
  • ****
  • Posts: 2616
  • Rating: 33
Re: Greg stewart
« Reply #40 on: April 01, 2019, 11:28:15 AM »

I don't agree that he's a dud. In this instance the dud is our manager. Stewart is clearly a decent footballer (which is more than you can say for much of our squad) and yet he's continually ineffectual for us when he was almost prolific for a Killie team who most people would say is poorer than our team. The difference is the manager.

He could easily do well at Ibrox and would almost certainly bite us on the arse sooner or later. I'm nae saying he should get a new deal with us unless we can play to his strengths.

He doesn't fit our system. We knew that from his first spell ( when he was also horrendously unfit). McInnes doesn't do "luxury" players who have to track back, tackle, close down space etc. And a luxury player is exactly what Stewart is...


But.....he is also very much a one trick pony. His right foot is for standing on only. And it doesn't even do that very well. On his left foot....he is decentbut no more than that. Defenders know that he will always cut inside when he is on the right side of the pitch or head for the bye line on the left side. Allied to the fact he is slower than a wet weekend in Airdrie.....he should be nowhere near Pittodrie,


That he looked good in a Dundee side that was absolutely honking is no great surprise. Same at Killie, albeit Killie are a bit better than the Dundee side due to having a better manager. Both allowed Stewart to be the luxury player, no defensive duties required as the other 9 players in either side were essentially athletes able to run all day but with limited footballing ability.

Our luxury player is Cosgrove (Wilson is another but his game time is minimal at best). We cannot afford a second/third in Stewart. As I've said before....this guy has been available on a free transfer from Birmingham the past 2 summers. No one bit. Only Killie and us have showed the slightest interest, but not enough to sign him on a permanent contract (I do understand taking him on loan saves loads on wages.....but Killie, where he did fit in, lost him due to us being willing to stump up a higher proportion in subsidising his wages).  I'm certain the sevco link is a pile of poop. There are rumours DM has offered Stewart a permanent deal with us. I hope they are untrue because I honestly cannot see many clubs, if any, clamouring to sign him once he becomes a free agent in July. Killie probably would but he would be taking a hit of at least 50% on his Birmingham wage to go there.



Offline rocket_scientist

  • Club Legend
  • *****
  • Posts: 6445
  • Rating: -192
Re: Greg Stewart
« Reply #41 on: April 01, 2019, 12:08:59 PM »
He doesn't fit our system.

What is "our system"?

And what was the system that Clarke used when Stewart was so effective there?
Ancient Sound, Modern Noise

Offline Ten Caat

  • Midfield Maestro
  • ****
  • Posts: 2616
  • Rating: 33
Re: Greg Stewart
« Reply #42 on: April 01, 2019, 01:33:33 PM »
I explained it on the other GS thread....

Offline rocket_scientist

  • Club Legend
  • *****
  • Posts: 6445
  • Rating: -192
Re: Greg Stewart
« Reply #43 on: April 01, 2019, 02:22:09 PM »
I explained it on the other GS thread....

I have no doubt that you have heard and read that Stewart "doesn't fit our system" not just on this forum but elsewhere but I'm only asking you to explain what YOU mean by this?
Ancient Sound, Modern Noise

Offline Ten Caat

  • Midfield Maestro
  • ****
  • Posts: 2616
  • Rating: 33
Re: Greg Stewart
« Reply #44 on: April 01, 2019, 03:51:09 PM »
Ok I will repeat just for you...

DM requires his players to track back, to press the opposition to put in tackles when we are not in possession.

Stewart cannot do this. Ever.

I have described him as a "luxury" player. We already have one such player in Cosgrove, who in general is excused from the donkey work I have described further up the page (even he actually does try to do a bit, but his size and mobility make it a bit of a stretch to say that he does it with any great effect). We cannot afford 2 luxury players in the same side.


And.........Stewart is just nae very good. He had a decent half season with Kilmarnock where, as their luxury player, was excused all donkey work. Ditto in his time at Dundee. His time with us and Birmingham....far bigger clubs......have shown him up for what he is. A totally one footed,  horrendously slow, one trick pony with a moderate talent for taking free kicks (but a shite talent for taking corner kicks). All in all.....a poor man's Ian Angus


And I have absolutely no doubt McInnes will offer him a permanent contract..... :hammer:




Offline rocket_scientist

  • Club Legend
  • *****
  • Posts: 6445
  • Rating: -192
Re: Greg Stewart
« Reply #45 on: April 01, 2019, 04:09:04 PM »
Ok I will repeat just for you...

DM requires his players to track back, to press the opposition to put in tackles when we are not in possession.

Stewart cannot do this. Ever.

I have described him as a "luxury" player. We already have one such player in Cosgrove, who in general is excused from the donkey work I have described further up the page (even he actually does try to do a bit, but his size and mobility make it a bit of a stretch to say that he does it with any great effect). We cannot afford 2 luxury players in the same side.


And.........Stewart is just nae very good. He had a decent half season with Kilmarnock where, as their luxury player, was excused all donkey work. Ditto in his time at Dundee. His time with us and Birmingham....far bigger clubs......have shown him up for what he is. A totally one footed,  horrendously slow, one trick pony with a moderate talent for taking free kicks (but a shite talent for taking corner kicks). All in all.....a poor man's Ian Angus


And I have absolutely no doubt McInnes will offer him a permanent contract..... :hammer:

So the "system" that Stewart doesn't fit is that McInnes expects footballers not in possession to defend?

And you say that his system allows for only one player to not defend?

Are you saying that Clarke also has the same system as McInnes but that Stewart was the footballer excused from defending?
Ancient Sound, Modern Noise

Offline Ten Caat

  • Midfield Maestro
  • ****
  • Posts: 2616
  • Rating: 33
Re: Greg Stewart
« Reply #46 on: April 01, 2019, 07:20:19 PM »
That's pretty much it yes.

Offline rocket_scientist

  • Club Legend
  • *****
  • Posts: 6445
  • Rating: -192
Re: Greg stewart
« Reply #47 on: April 04, 2019, 12:46:48 AM »
His right foot is for standing on only.

Given the goal tonight, the match-winning goal, the key moment of the match, I'd say you're wrong again.
Ancient Sound, Modern Noise

Offline Ten Caat

  • Midfield Maestro
  • ****
  • Posts: 2616
  • Rating: 33
Re: Greg Stewart
« Reply #48 on: April 04, 2019, 09:46:37 AM »
The goal where he hit a shot with his right that rebounded off the Killie defender straight to McGinn?

I was right behind it in the RDS lower. The keeper had his shot covered, I've not watched the highlights of the game yet as I didn't get home till 11.45 but his shot to me didn't even look that well struck. But as I said in the match thread....I do concede when he replaced young Campbell we instantly looked a bigger threat. (up to that point Campbell had been the sitting midfielder with Shinnie advanced. After the substitution, Shinnie dropped a bit deeper to allow Stewart to play the advanced role).



Offline rocket_scientist

  • Club Legend
  • *****
  • Posts: 6445
  • Rating: -192
Re: Greg Stewart
« Reply #49 on: April 04, 2019, 11:42:30 AM »
He's not as one footed as Messi. It's a bizarre "criticism" to level at someone.

Not as ridiculous as saying "shite talent for taking corner kicks" though.

Or regurgitating "he doesn't fit our system" without understanding what you mean by this.
Ancient Sound, Modern Noise

Offline Ten Caat

  • Midfield Maestro
  • ****
  • Posts: 2616
  • Rating: 33
Re: Greg Stewart
« Reply #50 on: April 04, 2019, 11:56:37 AM »
I won't bite on your "understanding of not fitting our system" quote...….I absolutely guarantee I understand systems of play better than you do. (I will reveal here that I played the game professionally until sustaining a cruciate injury that in the mid 80s was a career ender. I was looked after well by my parent club....it occurred when loaned out to a lower league club to gain playing experience......My left knee has a carbon fibre graft holding it together which at the time was the gold standard of repairs)


When he takes corners.....look how often he fails to get it past the first man.

Offline rocket_scientist

  • Club Legend
  • *****
  • Posts: 6445
  • Rating: -192
Re: Greg Stewart
« Reply #51 on: April 04, 2019, 12:01:24 PM »
Not all footballers understand systems. Most footballers are intellectually sub-normal.
Ancient Sound, Modern Noise

Offline rocket_scientist

  • Club Legend
  • *****
  • Posts: 6445
  • Rating: -192
Re: Greg Stewart
« Reply #52 on: April 04, 2019, 12:33:12 PM »
The problem with the vast majority of "football men" being of sub average intelligence (as exactly half the population are) is that they kid themselves on that they're not thick by elevating the tactical element of the game to something akin to a black art, only accessible by specialist brains.

McInnes doesn't have a "system" that he's followed his whole career and the "system" he has now certainly doesn't prescribe "one luxury player only". What he has settled into recently is a back 4, 2 defensive-minded midfielders and a random deployment of 4 "others" in a desperate attempt to try to find success... or more accurately, try to find a formula that doesn't humiliate and embarrass.

Ferguson didn't have a magical "system" or formula. He always played 4 at the back but unlike Mourinho nor particularly Benitez, he didn't stick rigidly to 2 banks of four in a classic 4-4-2 system. One thing he did do very effectively at AFC was to encourage the full backs to hit the wings with long passes, immediately turning defence into attack and getting the likes of Eric Black to sprint from the middle of the pitch to the wings to receive it, a tactic Kevin Gallacher at DU was so brilliant at. He appreciated that football is a simple game and he didn't over complicate matters. He simply recruited excellent footballers - the GK and 2 x CB's being his foundations - in the right positions, studied the opposition for weaknesses and managed and inspired his charges better than anyone ever has in the history of the game. I know this because i went to school with Neale Cooper and got all the stories about SAF's reign not just in the period of over half a decade that he was our manager but in the decades since.

The diamond formation and "the hole" are the funniest manifestations of football men trying to pretend they're not thick.
Ancient Sound, Modern Noise

Offline RicoS321

  • Captain
  • ****
  • Posts: 3238
  • Rating: 74
Re: Greg Stewart
« Reply #53 on: April 04, 2019, 01:33:25 PM »
The diamond formation and "the hole" are the funniest manifestations of football men trying to pretend they're not thick.

Maybe, maybe not. I think that if you're trying to motivate your players to beat a better team (or any team) then you need to deploy these types of tactic. I don't mean the tactic of playing to either of the above, but the tactic of getting your players to believe that they are. If you're playing Celtic for the nth time this season, then it's important to differentiate between what you did last time you lost to what you're about to do that's going to get the win. These descriptions of formation are useful tools in motivating your team or individual players within that team. They don't have to physically manifest themselves on the pitch in order to perform a function. I don't doubt that Ferguson would have described a player as playing off (or behind) the front man in order to get across to that player that they had to track back from the front more than usual. That said, what your describing is the punditry use of these terms I expect. The good thing about last night is that when Stewart came on, he played very high up the park and centrally, giving the effective 4-4-2 in which he was succesful with at Killie. It worked.

Offline rocket_scientist

  • Club Legend
  • *****
  • Posts: 6445
  • Rating: -192
Re: Greg Stewart
« Reply #54 on: April 04, 2019, 02:24:55 PM »
The good thing about last night is that when Stewart came on, he played very high up the park and centrally, giving the effective 4-4-2 in which he was succesful with at Killie. It worked.

Now we are talking. From what I saw of him at Killie - and I wasn't studying that carefully - was that he was central or mid-left and deployed as an attacking option, creating much and scoring often. This is common sense given that he's left footed and is clearly better at creating rather than breaking. Getting the balance right is what every good team has and for every Neil Simpson and Brian Grant (breakers), we need a Gordon Strachan or a Jim Bett (creators/makers) in the middle of the park. Ryan Jack was an interesting one is that whilst he's more breaker than creator, his greatest strength is keeping possession and making the simple pass, which often leads to a sequence of passes where an opportunity is created and he can be at the thick of it.

What is NOT common sense was playing Greg Stewart on the right side, which McInnes has done. Whilst Clarke quite obviously got more out of GS than McInnes ever has, in two stints now, I think it will have much to do with "freedom" and "trust", not forgetting that his physical condition was appreciably better after he joined Killie. Clarke gave him the freedom to run at people and do what he does best, He didn't saddle him with strict positional or defensive or formation duties and he was free to get into the game how he saw fit. This obvious tactical deployment of putting a round footballer in a circular hole would have bred a positive mindset and trust in both what he was supposed to be doing and also the manager. It really isn't rocket science.
Ancient Sound, Modern Noise

Offline RicoS321

  • Captain
  • ****
  • Posts: 3238
  • Rating: 74
Re: Greg Stewart
« Reply #55 on: April 04, 2019, 02:44:51 PM »
I suppose the problem that McInnes has is that every one of his wide players, bar GMS, would probably give their best performances through the centre. McLennan struggled out wide last night, specifically with the tracking part of the game (and tripping over the ball) because - as a youngster - he reacts to every knock or losing of the ball with a 3 second pause (like Magennis used to do) to complain or contemplate before chasing back. He was anonymous once Stewart came on. To an extent, Stewart does the same, which is why he's preferred in the centre. However, as a senior player, he should be disciplined enough to do the graft out wide as and when required. I have no doubt that if Stewart had played from the start last night, at some point he would have been shifted out wide, which he'd never have to have done at Killie. McGinn has proved (and improved) under McInnes that he has the work ethic and ability to play wide and centrally, which wouldn't have been the case under Brown I don't believe. At the moment the question is whether it's best for the team for Stewart to play centrally at the expense of McLennan (who may continue to play out wide, but he'll be the one playing shite instead of Stewart), or does McInnes try and keep all three front players happy by allowing them to switch around throughout the game. If Stewart keeps up his form from last night and brings McGinn into the game like he did, then it's undoubtedly the best option to continue through the middle and McLennan will just have to be content getting minutes and learning his discipline, getting involved where he can.

Offline BigAl

  • SAGA Subscriber
  • Administrator
  • *****
  • Posts: 11972
  • Rating: 204
Re: Greg Stewart
« Reply #56 on: May 19, 2019, 03:05:48 PM »
SSN reporting that Stewart has signed for the Huns.

No loss, we move on
Steve warm his seat up

Online manc_don

  • Administrator
  • *****
  • Posts: 17446
  • Rating: 77
  • Not a Jafa
Re: Greg Stewart
« Reply #57 on: May 19, 2019, 08:12:26 PM »
We'll never know what he was actually capable of for us, shame.  He'll do well for them I think.

Offline Ten Caat

  • Midfield Maestro
  • ****
  • Posts: 2616
  • Rating: 33
Re: Greg Stewart
« Reply #58 on: May 19, 2019, 08:39:19 PM »
We'll never know what he was actually capable of for us, shame.  He'll do well for them I think.

I think he will barely play for them and be punted off on loan possibly in January, certainly next summer.

Only thing we gained from him was depriving Killie of his services (his true level). We were forced to play him and in doing so he weakened us, although injuries sort of forced McInnes' hand a few times.

Won't be missed