Superstar Tradesman Posted January 7, 2008 Share Posted January 7, 2008 Back to the money JC has available to him: £1.4m sounds a lot but he's only getting that spread over 3 years (under half a mill/year) and that could quite easily be mopped up by players wanting more money when their contracts are up. Hardly what I'd call 'being ambitious'. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobbyBiscuit Posted January 7, 2008 Share Posted January 7, 2008 The ceiling I was talking about was more to do with how big a job he could get. Is Aberdeen the pinnacle of his career, or could he get a shot at a 'bigger' job? Outwith the Old Firm, I think that many managers see teams in the Scots Prem as a stepping stone to the Championship in England, where they hope they'll do a job before getting a move to the holy grail of the English Premiership. Mark McGhee recently came out and said as much. I think we sometimes forget how bad the finances in Scotland are, and that these guys have short careers. It's only natural that they would be lured by financial security over personal glory. We as fans will never grasp how any player would want £££££ over games against the likes of Atletico and Bayern Munich. I agree with you, but that's speaking as a fan surely? This is just a job for him at the end of the day. Yeah, the ceiling i was talking about is how big a job he could get too. I wasn't meaning he's taken us as far as he can etc. Some people will choose personal glory over cash - Willie Miller and Henrik Larsson being prime examples. You are right in what you say though, that it is just a job to JC, but you kinda hoped that he would have forged some emotional attachment in the last 3 and a half years. of course, the brilliant nights we're talking about are seen as the platform for him to get himself a bigger job (in his eyes). But if he goes, he goes. We'll cope. We've lost better managers than him, and we've lost better players than Nicholson, Hart, Diamond and Clark before and we coped. It's a setback, but not one that we can't recover from. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TENEMENTFUNSTER Posted January 7, 2008 Share Posted January 7, 2008 Back to the money JC has available to him: £1.4m sounds a lot but he's only getting that spread over 3 years (under half a mill/year) and that could quite easily be mopped up by players wanting more money when their contracts are up. Hardly what I'd call 'being ambitious'. Compare it to the rest of the league. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
capitalsharpie Posted January 7, 2008 Share Posted January 7, 2008 Which goes back to the board of directors expectations and what they must do to sort it out. The can either keep caldo and the players that have taken us to where we are, whether you like clado or his tactics disnae matter, or you can go all the way back to square one, new manager, host of new players, which arguably must cost more in the long run, instabilty, dropping crowd number and back to where we were ten yeas ago. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Shabba Ranks Posted January 7, 2008 Share Posted January 7, 2008 So what then is the point in having leagues and cups then? If no one is interested professionally in glory/success then surely to benefit the player we shoulg get rid of all competitions nd just have a continual round robin of teams that go no whhre so as not to put the players out too much. Surely the point of being a professional athalete is to get to the highest point of success during your career and the finanial benefits follow that?? Not the other way around? I totally agree with you mate, but we just need to look at the simple example of players kissing the badge, then leaving clubs at the first sniff of more green. The only clubs in Scotland that I'd understand any of the four going to would be the Old Firm, as at least they then have a chance of glory. It's the difference between football being a sport, to a business. Money rules unfortunately. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Superstar Tradesman Posted January 7, 2008 Share Posted January 7, 2008 Compare it to the rest of the league. Who gives a fuck about what the rest of the league are doing? We were cutting wages when Dundee were overspending... where are they now? We were buying players and shoring the debt up when Hearts were doing the opposite... where are they now? I only concentrate on the teams above us on the table when Saturday comes around. We've got a great balance of money coming in and going out at the moment and a few more years of that could see us in a fantasitic situation. Breaking the bank to sign players would put us back to square one but showing a little ambition to the man who has got us in this situation in the first place, can only be a smart thing no? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stubo72 Posted January 7, 2008 Share Posted January 7, 2008 I have to admit to very mixed feelings about this whole situation. My heart says 'Get them all tae fuck!' - but my head says 'What the fuck are we gonna do without them!?'. In the long run it probably won't make much difference; we will continue to be a top-six side with the occassional semi-final and final, and the very occassional foray into Europe. The fact is that we have no money, aren't likely to suddenly find some and have no real way to earn any more either. I just don't get why we don't have players tied up on longer term deals well in advance of transfer-windows/ends of seasons?!? At least then we might make a few million from transfers every now and then. AFC will survive the departure of the Jimmies and the 'Rebels', but without a sea-change at the very top, we arenae gonna have many seasons better than the last one and this. Particularly disappointing given how mince the rest of the SPL are at the moment! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TENEMENTFUNSTER Posted January 7, 2008 Share Posted January 7, 2008 Who gives a fuck about what the rest of the league are doing? We were cutting wages when Dundee were overspending... where are they now? We were buying players and shoring the debt up when Hearts were doing the opposite... where are they now? Obviously you! But I agree we have to show some sort of ambition but that can't be easy when you are in the grubber to the tune of 13 mill and have a stadium to magic out yer arse in the near future. It's all very well showing ambition but the club got truly fucked by ambitiousness and if our level of ambition doesn't match that of Calderwood, lots of luck. I would like to think that Miller would be mindful of that and know that the club were giving him all they could in the circumstances, if you don't believe that then you may as well be saying "Miller, GTF". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Shabba Ranks Posted January 7, 2008 Share Posted January 7, 2008 you kinda hoped that he would have forged some emotional attachment in the last 3 and a half years. Just speculating here, but he probably has become emotionally attached to the club (he doesn't hide his feelings does he?), the fact that many connected with it can't/don't accept him and what he's done probably makes it harder for him to take. Good relationships are a two-way thing (so I'm led to believe ). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
capitalsharpie Posted January 7, 2008 Share Posted January 7, 2008 "Showing ambition" doesnt just mean going into the transfer market and spending 60 million on the first players with a hefty price tag to try and wow supporters (al la old firm and premiership) but ambition WITHIN the club ie sorting out ontracts in a professional and responible way, sorting out your youth system, having quality training grounds for example. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TENEMENTFUNSTER Posted January 7, 2008 Share Posted January 7, 2008 "Showing ambition" doesnt just mean going into the transfer market and spending 60 million on the first players with a hefty price tag to try and wow supporters (al la old firm and premiership) but ambition WITHIN the club ie sorting out ontracts in a professional and responible way, sorting out your youth system, having quality training grounds for example. All of which is necessary but won't happen overnight given the overwhelming debt and seeming ignorance of successive boards to these facts. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
capitalsharpie Posted January 7, 2008 Share Posted January 7, 2008 Fair enough, but like new years resoloutions, yoh have to break them own into manageable chunks and put a time frame on them to make them chievable, so: !)Sort out players contracts by 1st Jan. OOOPPPPS!!! six months too late. Give them an extension and they will see the errors of thier ways. FAILED Pish poor management from the higher levels in the club, who are answerable to no one and blame the fans when the heat is on for "not being behind the team enough" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TENEMENTFUNSTER Posted January 7, 2008 Share Posted January 7, 2008 Currently, based on most of the complaining on here, not saying it isn't completely merited btw, but Miller is actually the one who needs to answering a few more questions about the direction of the club, it's players and it's manager. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
capitalsharpie Posted January 7, 2008 Share Posted January 7, 2008 Absolutly, but, his hands are tied by milne who also holds purse strings! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TENEMENTFUNSTER Posted January 7, 2008 Share Posted January 7, 2008 Absolutly, but, his hands are tied by milne who also holds purse strings! That being so, a bit of explaining tomorrow will be necessary. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Superstar Tradesman Posted January 7, 2008 Share Posted January 7, 2008 I'm pretty sure Hart has been stuttering over his new contract since the summer and if not before. Zander and Clark were happy to sign any offer that AFC put in front of them and Nicolson has followed JC from Dunfermline to AFC. If I was to take a complete and unsubstantuated stab at what's happening; I'd say JC has been made an offer elsewhere, told those 4 (who are first names on his team sheet each week) to hang tight until summer and he'll take them to wherever he's going. If, and that's a big if, that's the case then it's purely down to a financial choice for all concerned. The squad and backroom staff have a great chance of some silverware this season and although our Euro dreams are realistically only going to last 2 more games, who in their right mind wouldn't want to be a part of that? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wee toon red Posted January 7, 2008 Share Posted January 7, 2008 If I was to take a complete and unsubstantuated stab at what's happening; I'd say JC has been made an offer elsewhere, told those 4 (who are first names on his team sheet each week) to hang tight until summer and he'll take them to wherever he's going. Not too dissimilar a scenario to the one when he left Dunfermline then, other than the fact none of the Dunfermline boys we took were out of contract so we had to cough up for them (including the Jimmys). Not entirely beyond the realms of possibility that you're right. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drewsome Posted January 8, 2008 Share Posted January 8, 2008 JC, put pen to paper and get on with building this club to a European trophy. Let the papers & naesayers do their worst. Nothing shuts them up like winning. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sharpie Posted January 8, 2008 Share Posted January 8, 2008 I totally agree with you mate, but we just need to look at the simple example of players kissing the badge, then leaving clubs at the first sniff of more green. The only clubs in Scotland that I'd understand any of the four going to would be the Old Firm, as at least they then have a chance of glory. It's the difference between football being a sport, to a business. Money rules unfortunately. It was interesting to read that McGhee has conceded the league title to the Old Firm on the BBC site. Has Calderwood ever conceded the League title before? As in, has he ever stated that it was his ambition to win the league before? Unrealistic? Maybe, but it was still refreshing to to hear a manager talk about finishing first or second and not just going for 3rd place. I think Calderwood is a competent manager at best and it is probably the best time for him to get a move to a mediocre English club that he craves as rebulding the Dons could set him back a couple of years. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kowalski Posted January 8, 2008 Author Share Posted January 8, 2008 IT'LL TAKE YEAR TO REBUILD DONS, SAYS CALDERWOOD 08:50 - 08 January 2008 Aberdeen manager Jimmy Calderwood has warned it will take more than a year and £1million to replace his key players should they depart Pittodrie in the summer and is still refusing to commit his future to the club. Defenders Michael Hart and Zander Diamond and midfielders Chris Clark and Barry Nicholson are poised to leave the Dons after turning down three-year contract extensions to stay. Director of football Willie Miller will reveal the players' decisions today but, with Plymouth having made an inquiry about Hart and also keen on Clark, Preston showing an interest in Hart and Nicholson, and Diamond linked with a move to Wolves, Leicester City and Nottingham Forest, Calderwood is facing a huge Reds rebuilding job. If the four leave and the manager is not given money to buy replacements, Calderwood's future in the north-east will come under even closer scrutiny. He said: "If all the players come back with negative responses then searching for alternatives will be a major challenge. "If we lose these players, but the coaching staff remains intact, then we will be left with a massive job on our hands of starting over again. "I don't think a rebuilding exercise to keep us at the level we are at could be done within a year. The supporters don't want to hear that but, as a manager, it's worrying. "We might get lucky and find some players who fit in seamlessly but if all four decide to go, along with Lee Miller, Richie Byrne and Steve Lovell, then you are talking about the squad we have being decimated." The offer from former Dundee United manager Paul Sturrock to take Hart to Plymouth leaves the Dons with a difficult decision. Should they sell now and get what they can or let the player see out his contract in the summer? Calderwood said: "We have so much to look forward to with a League Cup semi-final and the Uefa Cup games against Bayern Munich, butif an offer is made for the players it will be very difficult for us to turn it down. "The board has always been very supportive of the football staff at the club and I would love to finish the job this season and see how far we can go. But we are not in the habit of receiving offers for players and it would leave Willie Miller and I with a huge decision to make." The Dons manager has been fearing the worst for weeks following the failure of his players to commit and he conceded his club cannot compete with the finance on offer in England's lower leagues. The harsh reality is non-league football clubs can pay more than a side about to face Bayern Munich. Calderwood said: "Even the non-league sides in England can top the wages offered by my club. Who can seriously expect any player not to have his head turned when a more lucrative offer comes his way?" Calderwood's future and that of coaches Jimmy Nicholl and Sandy Clark has also still to be decided. The manager wants to know what plans the club has in place to strengthen the team again before he will commit to a new deal. He said: "My future is not a straightforward negotiation about the financial terms of the contract, the club's future ambitions are equally important. We have put together a really strong squad and, if it breaks up, putting a new one together will take money. "It's not just wages I am talking about. You can have a good budget for player wages but often the players who can really make a difference are contracted to other clubs. "Attracting players is not easy, especially when they see others leaving. These are all factors I have to weigh up." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TENEMENTFUNSTER Posted January 8, 2008 Share Posted January 8, 2008 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobbyBiscuit Posted January 8, 2008 Share Posted January 8, 2008 JC, put pen to paper and get on with building this club to a European trophy. Oooof!!! A Scottish one will do for now I think! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest BTR Posted January 8, 2008 Share Posted January 8, 2008 Aberdeen manager Jimmy Calderwood has warned it will take more than a year and £1million to replace his key players should they depart Pittodrie in the summer and is still refusing to commit his future to the club. So Mr Calderwood, remind us again how much those players cost Aberdeen FC to buy? Notwithstanding Michael Hart's departure and subsequent return from Livingston, all except Nicholson came through the youth system. So Mr Calderwood, ambition isn't all about spending money is it? Good managers have to break up and rebuild teams all the time. It would say more about Calderwood the man if he baulks at that challenge. I think I'd respect him alot more if he just came out and said that he wasn't getting a big enough pay increase. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
glasgow sheep Posted January 8, 2008 Share Posted January 8, 2008 My God. He's really racking up the excuses here isn't he. Mind you I fear he is right, given his complete inability to unearth decent players. Almost all the players he has signed that have done anything of note were already "big" names in Scottish football. We clearly can't afford to replace those leaving with similar "names" so we would have to rely on his scouting network and contacts (sic). Time for JC to show what he is made of. Will he step up or will he run off in hope of a big contract down south? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mackie's ace! Posted January 8, 2008 Share Posted January 8, 2008 I see Scotland are saying they'll have a manager in place by the nd of the month... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
️ Come on you Reds! ️
️ Come on you Reds! ️
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