WeegieRed Posted August 27, 2015 Share Posted August 27, 2015 You make the assumption that Hibs and the SRU would let Hearts move in and not hit them with a hefty bill for the privilege. No assumption about it. They've been discussing both scenarios for a while now. The costs involved have been discussed long ago. Personally what I find incredibly frustrating is AFC fans that have seen their team go debt free for the first time since fuck knows and build a team that is the envy of most clubs in Scotland now stating that we should admire a team that 3 years ago was one decision away from liquidation I recall similar stuff being touted by AFC fans when mad Vlad was bragging about a 50million pound main stand & hotel complex. Many sports teams have 'planned' to build new stands or new stadiums in 2-3 years'. Plans and reality are rarely kind to each other. The ever fickle football fan I'm not naive enough to think everything will now be all rosy in the garden forever, and that we don't need to look ahead. I've seen us been good on the pitch and stable off it before. And I saw, due a lack of foresight by many, us fall from grace and become a shambles on and off the pitch. We should be ensuring the same mistake is not made twice. Yes, you can say Hearts were in trouble a few years ago, but due to the actions of the old owners. I'm not praising them. I'm looking at Hearts now and what they're planning for the future. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rocket_scientist Posted August 27, 2015 Share Posted August 27, 2015 No assumption about it. They've been discussing both scenarios for a while now. The costs involved have been discussed long ago. I'm not naive enough to think everything will now be all rosy in the garden forever, and that we don't need to look ahead. I've seen us been good on the pitch and stable off it before. And I saw, due a lack of foresight by many, us fall from grace and become a shambles on and off the pitch. We should be ensuring the same mistake is not made twice. Yes, you can say Hearts were in trouble a few years ago, but due to the actions of the old owners. I'm not praising them. I'm looking at Hearts now and what they're planning for the future. Potential problem. Always wise to look at all scenarios, including beyond the boundaries, not just best and worse case. You said "old owners" at Hearts. We still have Milne. The "same mistakes" won't be repeated once those mistakes are known and understood. No problem can ever be solved without first being identified and acknowledged to be a problem. In our case, nobody has ever questioned Milne's motives. Given his position and track record at AFC, this should be scrutinised in detail. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tom_widdows Posted August 27, 2015 Share Posted August 27, 2015 Slightly on topic Just seen the plans Partick submitted to redevelop the open end of Firhill. 350 seater stand with flats, officers and retail https://publicaccess.glasgow.gov.uk/online-applications/files/8A6D92FA32A4656BDE707C194B4E36EE/pdf/14_02744_DC-ELEVATIONS_AS_PROPOSED-3150545.pdf Actually larger than the previous scheme they had rejected by the council back in 2011 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rocket_scientist Posted August 27, 2015 Share Posted August 27, 2015 Very on topic, this thread has been running for over SIX YEARS. Go back almost 20 years and our chairman was angling for a new stadium for Kingswells, on land that he coincidentally owned, whilst the paint was barely dry on the RD stand, which he built, and which was the deal-breaker that got the little shit into our club. It's still not happening. Meanwhile, the evidence of incompetent financial mismanagement has not been dissipated. That £600k of our money he spent on a feasibility study was a good spend but insignificant compared to the rest. And our footballers still don't have a training ground. He lied at the Capitol during the first shareholders meeting that the "product would always be the priority". 19 years later, we're still being run like shit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WeegieRed Posted August 28, 2015 Share Posted August 28, 2015 whilst the paint was barely dry on the RD stand, which he built, and which was the deal-breaker that got the little shit into our club. Actually amazing that stand ever got built. I don't remember any furore over it at the time - was there one? I suppose though it has its uses certainly as far as corporate goes and I'm sure it has made a lot of money down the years. The club would probably argue it has now paid for itself (from memory it cost £4m to build) through revenue. And, it might look out of place but the RDS is an impressive looking stand and it's the one I always go to. I used to be in the pro-new stadium camp. Maybe the out of town thing didn't bother me as much because I'm not living there, and when the artist impressions of the new ground were released I was on board. However, I've now cooled on it, and I look at Pittodrie and question what's so difficult to change. I'd like to see the corner filled in between the RDS and south to protect fans from the elements - maybe even a TV screen the club can play adverts on. Other than that, put a roof on section Y and attach it to the merkland. Just to make the stadiums a bit more closed in to stop the atmosphere "escaping". I don't think there's much wrong with the Merkland either, maybe a new roof to get rid of the pillars. Then it's just the main stand. Surely something can be done there, even if they have to build over the road (Sorry if this has already been covered, I'll make a mental note to read back the pst 6 years at some point). It really doesnt need to be an impressive looking arena, what's impressive about a ground is the atmosphere created. The Red Ultras have their home in the RDU now and they should be allowed to make it their own with safe standing. If they can get the upper deck full every week (3100 fans) with singers they'll create a right racket and no doubt on big nights when the stadium is full the rest of the ground will get involved. But if Stewart Milne announces tomorrow work is about to start on a new 22,000 stadium in Westhill then I might change my mind. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tom_widdows Posted August 28, 2015 Share Posted August 28, 2015 However, I've now cooled on it, and I look at Pittodrie and question what's so difficult to change. Have a look at the current planning and building regulations for new sports stadiums & stands. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rocket_scientist Posted August 28, 2015 Share Posted August 28, 2015 I can't remember any furore about the RDS, nor am I qualified to comment. By the time we left for Melbourne in 91 it didn't exist and when we came back in 94 it was up. Couldn't imagine there would have been. It's a great facility. The most stunning thing about all this history was that our brand new chairman agitated for a new stadium at all, within months rather than years, in the same decade as we had just spent the money to start redeveloping and modernising our spiritual home, and in fucking Kingswells of all places. The rest, as proved by the balance sheet every subsequent year thereafter, is history, and a matter of fact. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
manc_don Posted August 28, 2015 Share Posted August 28, 2015 As Tom says, there are a number of regulations that would prevent straight forward redevelopment. We have to remember that the reason a lot of clubs go out of town is due to space requirements. Not saying it's not possible as most things can be worked one way or another, but i'd agree with starting with the Merkland incorporating Section Y as a starter. Though I'd be very sad to see this being covered. Easily the most amusing place to watch a game at Pittodrie. Any development would have to be phased, could see 1/2 the south stand being developed at a time. Tom's sketch was quite radical and would certainly like to think it could be considered, whilst rotating the pitch would mean we couldn't use Pittodrie during the initial construction, it could potentially work. SPFL being kind of course! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tyrant Posted August 28, 2015 Share Posted August 28, 2015 As Tom says, there are a number of regulations that would prevent straight forward redevelopment. We have to remember that the reason a lot of clubs go out of town is due to space requirements. Not saying it's not possible as most things can be worked one way or another, but i'd agree with starting with the Merkland incorporating Section Y as a starter. Though I'd be very sad to see this being covered. Easily the most amusing place to watch a game at Pittodrie. Any development would have to be phased, could see 1/2 the south stand being developed at a time. Tom's sketch was quite radical and would certainly like to think it could be considered, whilst rotating the pitch would mean we couldn't use Pittodrie during the initial construction, it could potentially work. SPFL being kind of course! It would be interesting to see how quickly these issues could be overcome if the land that Pittodrie occupied currently wasn't valuable. Someone fancy posting Tom's handy work? Curious to see it! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
manc_don Posted August 28, 2015 Share Posted August 28, 2015 It would be interesting to see how quickly these issues could be overcome if the land that Pittodrie occupied currently wasn't valuable. Someone fancy posting Tom's handy work? Curious to see it! It's not financial that drives this, it's sporting stadia and building regulations. I doubt we'd be having this conversation if those flats weren't built next to Pittodrie. The very fact they have been built means there are a whole raft of other issues you have to comply with. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hewitt 11 Posted September 2, 2015 Share Posted September 2, 2015 Pittodrie is our church will be sad to see us leave it as its history and part of the dons make up in that its brought us many memories in the past . Its time to move to Loirston sort out the massive beer hall make it a family day out have rail station and better transport links for us from Falkirk easy access from the south of the city Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tyrant Posted November 12, 2015 Share Posted November 12, 2015 Fit's this? http://planning.aberdeencity.gov.uk/PlanningDetail.asp?js=y&ref=151345 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
manc_don Posted November 12, 2015 Share Posted November 12, 2015 Fit's this? http://planning.aberdeencity.gov.uk/PlanningDetail.asp?js=y&ref=151345 A couple of PortaKabins, eh EdinburghDon Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RicoS321 Posted November 12, 2015 Share Posted November 12, 2015 The dons train at Countesswells, and had to put up some changing facilities separate to those used by kids I think. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WeegieRed Posted December 3, 2015 Share Posted December 3, 2015 Hearts announce at their AGM they expect to be building their new main stand within the next 12 months. It'd be nice to hear at least some progress in that time from Aberdeen on either the stadium or training ground. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tom_widdows Posted December 3, 2015 Share Posted December 3, 2015 Hearts announce at their AGM they expect to be building their new main stand within the next 12 months. It'd be nice to hear at least some progress in that time from Aberdeen on either the stadium or training ground. Announcements mean nothing. The follow up is they wont reveal any details until they know what hurdles they have to clear. The only planning application for tynecastle improvements is a legacy from romanov which includes hotels, apartments etc and there is no money for all of that (its also nearly 8 years old). Given the complexity of the site and how strained and slow Edinburgh Council planning & building standards are at the moment I'd say that statement is going to come back to haunt them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WeegieRed Posted December 3, 2015 Share Posted December 3, 2015 Announcements mean nothing. The follow up is they wont reveal any details until they know what hurdles they have to clear. The only planning application for tynecastle improvements is a legacy from romanov which includes hotels, apartments etc and there is no money for all of that (its also nearly 8 years old). Given the complexity of the site and how strained and slow Edinburgh Council planning & building standards are at the moment I'd say that statement is going to come back to haunt them. They seem to be well down that road that, purchasing land around the stadium and improving their footprint. They're confident it'll be built with 18 months and I don't see them struggling to do that. Obviously building a new stadium completely is something else, even a new training ground, but I really hope by summer we (the fans) have a lot more information than we currently do. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tom_widdows Posted December 3, 2015 Share Posted December 3, 2015 I am curious as to the land they have managed to purchase. The police were very critical of Vlads Proposal as were the Community Council. It did also make the assumption they could just flatten everything around them. I believe Budge is no fool but I still think it was a mistake to say 12months at an AGM then almost immediately follow it up with 'no details until we are absolutely sure' Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WeegieRed Posted December 4, 2015 Share Posted December 4, 2015 I am curious as to the land they have managed to purchase. The police were very critical of Vlads Proposal as were the Community Council. It did also make the assumption they could just flatten everything around them. I believe Budge is no fool but I still think it was a mistake to say 12months at an AGM then almost immediately follow it up with 'no details until we are absolutely sure' One of the big stumbling blocks was the nursery school that is across the road from Tynecastle. Romanov wanted to buy and flatten it. However Budge wants it to be part of the new main stand - I don't know if that means knocking it down and rebuilding it or building round it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scotfree Posted December 4, 2015 Share Posted December 4, 2015 It's a shame when a team that was nearly gone a few years back are more proactive than what we are. Pittodrie is getting well past it now. I will be sorry to see it go, but we need to go forward. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tom_widdows Posted December 4, 2015 Share Posted December 4, 2015 One of the big stumbling blocks was the nursery school that is across the road from Tynecastle. Romanov wanted to buy and flatten it. However Budge wants it to be part of the new main stand - I don't know if that means knocking it down and rebuilding it or building round it. The Nursery school isnt across the road. It is directly behind and overshadowed by the main stand and essentially extends from the corner to the centre spot. If that is to be included within the new stand they will need to find some way or compensating for the loss of outdoor space. Alternatively the stand could be designed 'lopsided' so that the roseburn half is significantly smaller than the gorgie road side. A more extreme version of the the old Dell Stand perhaps. Hearts are going to face the same issues with design as the dons do with trying to redeveloping pittodrie. The escape routes of the 3 newer stands are quite clever but do they now comply with the current regulations and will there be sufficient access for emergency vehicles (one of the main points raised by the cops with the Vlad design) without reducing the capacity? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WeegieRed Posted December 8, 2015 Share Posted December 8, 2015 Can anyone remember all the proposed locations for the new stadium the club were considering. Loirston (obviously). There was talk of Kingswells. Where else? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WeegieRed Posted December 30, 2015 Share Posted December 30, 2015 Serious (okay, stupid) question, but storm Frank got me thinking. Would having the stadium next to a Loch be a problem in weather like this? Likeihood of flooding (maybe not the stadium itself but some of the stadium footprint, car park, etc? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rocket_scientist Posted December 30, 2015 Share Posted December 30, 2015 Serious (okay, stupid) question, but storm Frank got me thinking. Would having the stadium next to a Loch be a problem in weather like this? Likeihood of flooding (maybe not the stadium itself but some of the stadium footprint, car park, etc? Given that Loirston is fifty miles above the level of the river Dee, yes, it's a stupid question. Like exceptionally stupid. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WeegieRed Posted January 29, 2016 Share Posted January 29, 2016 Given that Loirston is fifty miles above the level of the river Dee, yes, it's a stupid question. Like exceptionally stupid. Can't be that stupid a question if there's been a 24 page report written on whether there would be a risk of flooding at Loirston or not. http://planning.aberdeencity.gov.uk/docs/showimage.asp?j=151073&index=155742 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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