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Scottish Premiership:

Aberdeen v Livingston

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fatjim
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  1. 1. ?

    • JMG
    • I'm not particularly happy with things and he is far from God
    • JIG
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    • 2


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My official stance is as follows:

 

Jimmy has taken Aberdeen as far as he's able... in fact the signs are we're beginning to move backwards, after a couple of years making good progress.

 

It's time for someone new, but I can't see it making much of a difference long term.... In my opinion the main problems with our club can be sourced further up the pyramid.

 

I would also worry where we're going to find someone better than Jimmy.  There aren't many other options.  Mark McGhees CV suggests that he is not a long term solution.... it'd also cost a fortune to pay off both; Calderwoods contract, and Motherwells compensation.

 

In conclusion, I think our club is a bit of shambles, however, I am at a complete loss as to how we could even begin to change things...  :

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My own position, and many others I know has been to continually try to understand the bigger picture, the context and the environment we are in. To take into account the competitive market place, the attitude of players in modern football, the role of agents and financial managers, globalisation of football as a sport to try and see that football is not a simple game and to appreciate that hindsight can bring power without responsibility. However, also to avoid being blinkered by a manager who talks a lot (often a lot of shit), operates with traditional management values that are often out of sync, deflects and sidelines opinion when it doesn't suit and lacks any real sense of class or professionalism in his communication. In summary, I have always felt JC was limited but was willing to stick with him until something better was at our disposal.

 

While we are discussing the idea of absolutist points of view and the lack of reasoned discussion can I raise another related annoyance I have.

 

There are fans who have been saying that JC should be given the boot for a few years now. There are fans that are now saying they think he should go who may not have said so a few years ago. I can't be fucked with this idea that somehow these people were 'right all along' and that they had been 'trying to tell us but we didn't listen'.

 

It doesn't mean you were right all along, it means you were less tolerant and less capable of seeing the balanced viewpoint. It means that you were less willing or capable of analysing and assessing and more interesting in knee jerk and hysteria. Fans who are willing to take a step back and view from a wider lens are entitled to shift their opinion on the basis of feeling that the balance is shifting too. If our situation deteriorates significantly (like another cup calamity) then its OK to finally decide you now want change without being made to feel that you were always wrong and that now you have been shown some sort of divine path. Its bullshit and its part of the same childish input that we are constantly exposed to on low grade sites.

 

....incidently, I didn't vote  :-\

 

 

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Clouds the poll.

 

Also removed JISMGOD as it was just a joke.  :thumbsup:

 

It's merely an exercise in exorcising the JIG myth.

 

see what I did there?

 

Why not have three decent options rather than two stereotypical answers and one decent one?

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My tuppenceworth.

 

He has the 4th highest budget in the league so, apart from one year, he's met his performance targets.

 

I hear the argument that McGhee et al are performing well on a fraction of our budget or punching above their weight but Calderwood is not afforded the same benefit when he does achieve his targets or for when he finished third.

 

I'm sure there are better managers around but history shows AFC have an unnerving ability to pick our replacements poorly. And there are many worse than him.

 

He attracts good players like Miller, Seve and Smith so I wouldn't mind if he was given the chance to see through what he's started. However if we could 100% pick a man who could take us to the mythical next level (on the same budget) then I'd change him tomorrow.

 

In conclusion, JIABISHFSA. (Jimmy is alright but I'd swap him for Sir Alex).

 

 

 

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There are fans who have been saying that JC should be given the boot for a few years now. There are fans that are now saying they think he should go who may not have said so a few years ago. I can't be fucked with this idea that somehow these people were 'right all along' and that they had been 'trying to tell us but we didn't listen'.

 

It doesn't mean you were right all along, it means you were less tolerant and less capable of seeing the balanced viewpoint. It means that you were less willing or capable of analysing and assessing and more interesting in knee jerk and hysteria. Fans who are willing to take a step back and view from a wider lens are entitled to shift their opinion on the basis of feeling that the balance is shifting too. If our situation deteriorates significantly (like another cup calamity) then its OK to finally decide you now want change without being made to feel that you were always wrong and that now you have been shown some sort of divine path. Its bullshit and its part of the same childish input that we are constantly exposed to on low grade sites.

 

 

Mizer i think he's speaking about you.......... ;)

 

After taking some time to calm down after the Dunfermline game i'm pretty much sitting on the fence, for me Ajja summed it up pretty well, i neither think calderwood is a god, or should be hounded out of pittodrie.  Of course there are aspects of his performance i'm not too happy with, but until there is an outstanding candidate to take over i'll give him some time.  No point at all in replacing him with someone who will simply be different shade of shite.

 

 

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:clap:

 

I did vote for option 3 but I am still reasoned in my thoughts on the matter. I am yet to think we need to get rid because I refuse to knee jerk. I just don't see us improving in anyway if we were to get rid of Calderwood. 

 

 

So no matter who we bring in, we won't improve?

 

That we might go backwards isn't a reason not to change - change is risky, and it can be good. At this juncture, I think the club is stale - I believe a change would be good for the whole organisation - fans, players, abudy.

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What do you suggest?

 

As I said it was merely a mythbuster for me.

Cue people voting JIG to ruin the poll.

If you vote JIG give a reason.

 

 

I would suggest two options as some people do not want him to go right at this moment but would like to at the end of the season and may feel they do not want to click the JMG option as it indicates they want him sacked now possibly.

 

If I had done it I would have had an option for 'Sack Calderwood right now' and 'Get rid of him at the end of the season'. Possibly even another option for wait and see how we are doing at the end of the season. But this is your poll and its up to you, Im just going to sit and the side and snipe  :thumbsup:

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So no matter who we bring in, we won't improve?

 

That we might go backwards isn't a reason not to change - change is risky, and it can be good. At this juncture, I think the club is stale - I believe a change would be good for the whole organisation - fans, players, abudy.

 

Good point but swapping like for like (enter Mark McGhee) is change for the sake of change. Given the money it would cost to fire JC, such change may well be counter productive. Why not spend the money on the team?

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Good point but swapping like for like (enter Mark McGhee) is change for the sake of change. Given the money it would cost to fire JC, such change may well be counter productive. Why not spend the money on the team?

 

I was about to type something along these lines...

 

Ideally, I'd like to see Aberdeen finish strongly, before a recognition in the summer from both parties that JC has taken AFC as far as he can, giving him a pay off.

 

Feasibly though, I haven't heard from any of the three chat sites an outstanding candidate to replace Jim, I can't see him going anywhere voluntarily, and we don't have the money to pay the management team off.

 

Stuck with him, methinks. :-\

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My tuppenceworth.

 

He has the 4th highest budget in the league so, apart from one year, he's met his performance targets.

 

 

That's true, but is also sidestepping the issue of his cup record. It is, for the moment, the only realistic chance of silverware our club has, and our club badly needs silverware too. He has consistently and catastrophically under-achieved in this area.

 

I'm sure there are better managers around but history shows AFC have an unnerving ability to pick our replacements poorly. And there are many worse than him.

 

We should not and can not fear change.  I know that you're right about previous appointments, but JC was a good appointment and I think WM deserves the credit for appointing the right guy to stabilise us and then kick us on (of which, JC deserves a lot of praise). So why shouldn't we have faith in WM making another shrewd appointment?

 

I think we've stagnated and I think change will do the whole club good.  To stick with him out of fear of what may come, when so many things just don't seem right under his stewardship is no way forward in my opinion. If that's the way it works, how long do we give it?  Until he's driven away another couple of thousand fans from the home games?  Until he's "lost the dressing room"?  Hindsight is wonderful of course, but we do have to gamble at times.

 

He attracts good players like Miller, Seve and Smith so I wouldn't mind if he was given the chance to see through what he's started.

 

I agree about attracting good players like those above and the likes of Kerr, McDonald and Aluko too and again he should be praised for that. He has also made some baffling choices in the transfer market and while I appreciate that if you continually shop in the 99p store you will pick up a lot of crap as well as a bargain or two, some of his decisions have just been plain bonkers.

 

Regarding the "finishing what he started", we probably won't know when it's finished until it's too late and we're hitting the skids. I have a feeling that this may have happened already. Of two of our biggest players, Severin is uninterested, Smith is perenially injured and there is generally a stale look to that side now. He has said he may only bring in one player in the summer. That terrifies me. That team needs major work done on it, if he can't see it there's something wrong.

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After taking some time to calm down after the Dunfermline game i'm pretty much sitting on the fence, for me Ajja summed it up pretty well, i neither think calderwood is a god, or should be hounded out of pittodrie.  Of course there are aspects of his performance i'm not too happy with, but until there is an outstanding candidate to take over i'll give him some time.  No point at all in replacing him with someone who will simply be different shade of shite.

 

 

 

Pretty much sums it up for me. I kind of sense his time is up, but no point in change for the sake of it, and jumping out of the frying pan into the fire. Still not sure who the best potential candidate within our limited resources might be, but one thing I'm convinced of that it isn't Dingus.

Suffice to say I'm not protesting against him or the team at present.

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That's true, but is also sidestepping the issue of his cup record. It is, for the moment, the only realistic chance of silverware our club has, and our club badly needs silverware too. He has consistently and catastrophically under-achieved in this area.

 

We should not and can not fear change.  I know that you're right about previous appointments, but JC was a good appointment and I think WM deserves the credit for appointing the right guy to stabilise us and then kick us on (of which, JC deserves a lot of praise). So why shouldn't we have faith in WM making another shrewd appointment?

 

I think we've stagnated and I think change will do the whole club good.  To stick with him out of fear of what may come, when so many things just don't seem right under his stewardship is no way forward in my opinion. If that's the way it works, how long do we give it?  Until he's driven away another couple of thousand fans from the home games?  Until he's "lost the dressing room"?  Hindsight is wonderful of course, but we do have to gamble at times.

 

I agree about attracting good players like those above and the likes of Kerr, McDonald and Aluko too and again he should be praised for that. He has also made some baffling choices in the transfer market and while I appreciate that if you continually shop in the 99p store you will pick up a lot of crap as well as a bargain or two, some of his decisions have just been plain bonkers.

 

Regarding the "finishing what he started", we probably won't know when it's finished until it's too late and we're hitting the skids. I have a feeling that this may have happened already. Of two of our biggest players, Severin is uninterested, Smith is perenially injured and there is generally a stale look to that side now. He has said he may only bring in one player in the summer. That terrifies me. That team needs major work done on it, if he can't see it there's something wrong.

 

This is where my stand on the matter lies. I think he has to go, and voted the JMG. As most of you know, I don't label myself as a JMGer as they appear quite often single minded and have been so for a long time. The Dunfermline game was the final straw. I have lost faith in the team I love, lost a fuck load of passion (albeit temporarily I hope) and I just don't think he's the man to take us on. As you quite rightly point out BB, what he has done has been fantastic, I just don't think he can take us further than he already has. There are also signs that it maybe going backwards and I think its imperative that the club recognise this in the summer. WM brought in the right man at the right time, I hope he will do the same in the summer. Whilst economic factors and the current financial climate may dictate otherwise, I am hoping that the club will act as I fear for the long time future of our fanbase. The brand of football and constant let downs in the cups are costing us fans as more and more are turned away with their "investment" if you will.

Thanks Mr Calderwood, but you've done all you can, please do what you wanted to do over Christmas and leave in the summer.

 

P.s. finish strongly so someone will take you and we get compo, thanks ;)  :thumbsup:

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Good point but swapping like for like (enter Mark McGhee) is change for the sake of change. Given the money it would cost to fire JC, such change may well be counter productive. Why not spend the money on the team?

 

This is one of the things that worrys/annoys me about the JMG thing.  If fan pressure eventually wields the power to remove Jimmy from office, then I'd worry Milne/Miller may look towards McGhee in order to appease the supporters (who is, I'm afraid, overwhelmingly the fans choice).  One thing I am certain of, is that Mark McGhee is not the answer.

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This is one of the things that worrys/annoys me about the JMG thing.  If fan pressure eventually wields the power to remove Jimmy from office, then I'd worry Milne/Miller may look towards McGhee in order to appease the supporters (who is, I'm afraid, overwhelmingly the fans choice).  One thing I am certain of, is that Mark McGhee is not the answer.

 

I agree he is not the answer, but I'm not sure he's overwhelmingly the fans choice.  Quite a few of those are just wanting change for change sake.

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