Edinburghdon

18 hours ago, Jute said:

Bit in bold is me. Every year I say this is last year but every year at this time I crack and renew it. £400 for uncovered seat I must be mad. Too many games moved for TV or for no reason which mean I never really save money. Definitely the last year.

 

 

 

 

 

Feel free to remind of this when I renew next year. 

Plot twist... It absolutely wont be 

1 hour ago, RicoS321 said:

Apologies, I wasn't suggesting you were saying they were lying, I was asking if that's what you were saying - that wasn't clear.

I assumed that the club's protocol that was broken was the four households rule. Or, more simply, breaking of a general public lockdown rule - by default - is a breach of club protocol (hence the previous case didn't break it). Some good points there though, I hadn't considered they might ask a series of questions about where players had been. That would suggest that the players either lied about it, which I find unlikely, or the person asking the questions failed to pick up that 8 players responded the same (in which case the club would have made the additional suggested return to training error, not the players). That it took until the Thursday isn't surprising to me, as that would have been when the test results were returned. Listening to Hayes' interview, the suggestion was that the players hadn't considered what they'd done was incorrect until that point. The fact he was given that platform on the club's YouTube channel suggests that the club believe that account and that there was no attempt by the players to cover anything up. 

What is clear, is that it really isn't that clear! That's the bit I find the most frustrating. Nobody on here seems to know, yet have been fairly scathing despite that. The only offence we can be certain of is fairly minor. If they lied to the club, that turns it into something different. If the club have fucked up then we need to know too. However, more importantly, if the only breach was the 4 household rule then it appears the protocols in place would never, and could never mitigate for a genuine covid case, alternatively, the cancelling of games was a punitive measure. It has to be one of those two things. 

The way I read it was if it was just the 4 household rule that they broke then surely the statements saying club protocols too would be redundant, makes me believe there were separate club guidelines broken.

The club also made a big song a dance about the cost of the private testing so I’d assume the results would be same day or as near as or it’d be pointless, seem to remember a video the club posted showing that too although I can’t be arsed looking for it anymore.
 

At the end of the day it’s irrelevant how clear it is to us, it’ll have been drilled in to the players and staff so they’ve only themselves to blame really. Although there’s a decent amount of info on the SFA site on the general framework (minimal interaction between players outside games/training etc, testing, screening) even if the specifics of the club policies aren’t published. 
 

The abuse and stick they’re seemingly getting is out of order but the punishments probably aren’t (assuming the standard punishments in line with rule 24 etc are applied).

1 hour ago, RicoS321 said:

Thanks, that makes sense. So how does that differ from normal then? If three groups of three had gone to different Aberdeen nightspots and two had contracted covid, what would happen? What's the difference between broken rules covid and non-broken-rules covid? I don't see how multiple covid cases can be handled within the protocols? 

Just to get this correct, the players were tested and two returned positive for covid. At this point this could have been a "normal" case of covid. One that could have been picked up before Saturday's game (when all 8 players would have been together), so the same measures would surely have taken place either way? The bubble they work in is broken every game surely? 

Just to be clear, are you saying that the players lied about being out together? Or that the club lied about it? 

I genuinely couldn’t tell you with any certainty how it differs from a normal situation, I was mainly pointing out the club has been pretty clear in the fact they’ve not just broken the government COVID guidance but they’ve also broken the clubs protocols (and by association the SFA’s given they seem to call for protocols of a certain standard to be in place as part of the return to professional football).

If I had to guess though the screening they need to go through each morning before being allowed to enter the training ground is designed to highlight if the players have been in higher risk environments or if they’ve not been social distancing outwith training etc and if that’s flagged up it’d mean isolation for the player to ensure the rest of the squad/staff aren’t exposed to risk. Likewise finding out where they’d been, with who and when is probably key in deciding how to handle any positive cases, so if they’d likely picked it up the day before without having been in contact with the squad then it’d be fairly straightforward, if they’d likely picked it up day’s previously and been training normally since (as appears to have been the case) its a more complicated situation. But like I’ve said that’s a guess based on what the clubs said about their return to training protocols previously.  The club would need to publish the protocols in order to be sure. The fact we’d previously had a positive test of a player without any suggestion he broke return to training protocols shows they can differentiate between cases when the rules are followed and cases where they aren’t though when it comes to the risk of spreading to the rest of the squad.

Not sure what part of my post reads like I accused the players or the club of lying about any of this, I’ve not suggested as such...but now you mention it you can probably draw your own conclusions given the club investigated, found the players to have broken protocols and the report that it was the Thursday before any of this kicked off.

2 hours ago, RicoS321 said:

No I'm not. I said the punishment is being made up as they go along, not the crime. The club have stated that they broke the four households rule (which is the same for everyone). Nobody has suggested any further breaking of the rules. Are you happy that is the only rule that has been broken, or have you got evidence of other rules being broken (I'm more than happy to change my position if I'm wrong)? Working on the basis that I, and the club, are correct then the breaking of the four households rule in and of itself did not cause the two players to get covid, agreed (they could have gone in to three different restaurants or in three separate tables in the same place and caught it)? I'm not trying to legitimise what the players did, they clearly broke the rules, I'm saying that the rule break is reasonably minor and one which many people in the UK will have broken to a greater or lesser degree themselves. It comes with its own ready-made punishment with 14 days isolation, missing of games and on top a deserved club fine and I would suggest that the SPFL add in a minimum 3 games missed for anyone in breach of the rules to even things up (in case players in isolation miss two games, where some miss three). 

The point I was making was regarding the Scottish government's intervention. First, the reaction to the Aberdeen players was way over the top, to the point of hysteria. It called for a measured response that took into account the gravity of the crime. That way when far worse rule breaking occurs, in the case of bolingoli, you have the ability to step up the criticism where required to recognise more serious breaches. The AFC offence could have been used positively to show a small breach can have a big impact. That's what I'd expect from a leader like Sturgeon. Her actual reaction is what I'd expect from Johnson. I accept that is also a minor criticism and new territory for the government. Second, was the cancellation of games. I can forgive the st Johnstone game, the government were caught by surprise, late notice etc. What happened after that showed that punishments were being dished out by the government rather than SPFL and that they were being made up on the hoof. That, for me, sets a ridiculous precedent that could see the cancellation of the season if continued. There is no scientific difference between a person who has caught covid because of a breach of rules and one who's caught it normally. We were led to believe that the testing and protocols in place would allow players to get covid and not result in cancellations. The cancellations suggest that is not the case. The lack of cancellation of the Kilmarnock game after bolingoli played in the prior game suggests it's being made up on the hoof. I think that state intervention into fitba's punitive measures should have us all concerned if that was the case. Which is it? Do you know?

If you're going to make up rules, then you need to expect that these rules will be breached. What to do when those breaches occur should have been strategised as soon as the rules were made, not made up on the fly. It reeks.

The club also said they broke the return to training protocols didn’t they?
 

Isn’t the whole reason the games were postponed because the players returned to training despite having been out and as soon as they did that there was no way of knowing if they’d passed it on to the rest of the squad/staff and therefore control of the biosecure environment they have to maintain to allow training/matches to take place was lost.
 

I'm sure in the initial reports were that it was the Thursday before the extent of what happened became clear and everyone was sent home from training. Surely that’s the more major issue in what they’ve done as it meant the “bubble” they were working in had burst. If they’d followed the proper return to training protocol then the players involved would have isolated, the rest of the squad could have prepared for the games, it would have just been an internal matter and none of this would be happening. 
 

Reading the SFA statements they’re not being punished for going out to a pub it’s not following the rules in place, I.e the return to training protocols and the club not being able to guarantee the rest of the squad isn’t effected which given we’ve now had to have 3 of our games postponed in a season that’s already tight for free dates isn’t completely unreasonable.

Always felt Crawford whilst no doubt talented is just too lightweight to be consistently effective in the SPFL. And don't think Naismith returning was the reason for his rejection at Fartz. Its a no from me.

 

Really have no recollection at all of Nowak playing but defensive cover is an urgent requirement so if this does fly then I'll trust DM's judgement.

Crawford has just signed for Doncaster Rovers.

This. I took a sicky yesterday with the bastard of all colds that had been hanging around since Sunday night, got a text this morning to not bother coming to work. Went out to W.A.N.K.S.hill tesco to stock up at lunchtime, and couldn't believe the lack of snow. Absolute joke that folk are closing for the day or making no effort to get to work.

We’ve been sent home from work in westhill early the last 2 days. Roads completely clear etc, it’s a joke.

Final two. Looking good for the dons...

Seems there’s 41 councillors to vote, not all are making a wee speech though.

Preston agree fee for Devlin, next.

It’s being reported we’ve put in a late bid too. Guess it shows how serious mcinnes is in wanting devlin if we have indeed made a bid.

McLean deal confirmed.

 

https://www.afc.co.uk/2018/01/22/kenny-joins-norwich-city-returns-loan/

There's some great quotes in there, reflects really well on both McLean and how the club have handled things.

Fantastic deal, getting cash for a player we knew would be leaving anyway, keeping a key part of our midfield and 6 months to sort out a quality replacement too. Top work from the club there!

McLean has really gone about this move well and deserves some credit for being so open about his intentions.  His performances have improved of late too, here's hoping that continues and he leaves with a SC winner medal 

Can’t believe all the positive comments about McLean. Where did all this come from?? He’s an attacking midfielder who doesn’t score enough and doesn’t assist enough. He can’t shoot for shit, plus can’t tackle or head the ball. You’ve got McGinn, Christie, and Stewart who can all play #10, with Shinnie, AOC and the new boy all able to play the two deeper position. Fuck, I’d even rather Storie got a chance ahead of a guy who is leaving.

 

KM will not be the difference between 2nd and 3rd, don’t see the logic there at all. He’s not our captain, leader, play maker, nor heavily influential in defense or attack. He’s not Joe Lewis, no McKenna or Shinnie, those guys would be a loss.

 

We take 500k if it’s there, complete no brainer for a guy who wants to leave. We all get that, right? He doesn’t want to stay. Transfer funds are limited, that 500k can be used to snap up a pre contract or two. Don’t expect a replacement for him immediately but this is a complete no brainer.

I think the point is we are severely limited in midfielders as it is, losing one of our first 11 will definitely be felt given the total lack of options to replace him within the squad.

Even with his limitations its not a stretch to say getting rid of McLean without replacing him could well be the difference between 2nd and 3rd. A gaping hole in an already lightweight (almost cobbled together at times) midfield would make maintaining our position very difficult.

Of course taking the £500k is a no brainer, but ONLY if he's adequately replaced straight away.

Could they no just build it on the Duthie Park? I've seen all there is to see there so they can bulldoze it now! 

Positive, would be a 5 min walk from the house

Negative, would lose the ideal place to walk the dog.

On balance I reckon I'd have to start up NDPS (No Duthie Park Stadium) and fight the plans as irritatingly as NKS have. 

It doesn't have to be there though. The only points I was making were that:

 

1. Don't just build something for the sake of it, it it's not right then it's not right. Saying "I/you can't think of anything better so we just have to get on with it" is sheer stupidity and something that we'll ultimately regret as the city grows and changes.

2. Build it as part of a design for the city and in tandem with the city so it is completely integrated (like Pittodrie was when it was built - it certainly can't be held responsible for the shite design of BOD). If that means we have to wait a bit, then that's fine too. We shouldn't be doing this as a stand alone project with no infrastructure - that's suicidal.

I get that wasn’t the point you were making, it was a response to manc’s point about waiting for King links to become available.

Agree with your points but There will be a point that simply waiting for something perfect to appear when the council shows no interest in assisting or being involved in a joint plan becomes infeasoble though.

We could get docherty of Hamilton for 500k you would think

If we could it would almost be a no brainier.

He has a point. The amount of shite that Aberdeen cc passes and the one thing that could be of benefit (ignoring the flaws) is going to get chucked. It’s pathetic and representative of the mindset. Shame.

 

But Rico makes a good point and it is probably our only other viable option. Sit tight, hope that the kings links site becomes available and try again....

Is sitting tight until the driving range lease runs out in 2040 feasible? Craig group have already said they aren’t going to break it early and the council appear to be unwilling to force them to.

6 months left on his contract and can leave for free in the summer. It's a decent offer if true.

As much as he’s upped his game lately I’d take that, hope at least some of any fee would go towards a good replacement.

Grow up. Folk have opinions that don't match yours, so they're in some way destroying the future or heritage of the city?

 

Kingsford has fuck all to do with the city of Aberdeen, this is an AFC stand-alone project. It is entirely for the benefit of AFC, and has zero benefit for the rest of the city. It doesn't integrate with the city and it doesn't sit inside a city wide plan.

 

People recognise a hugely compromised plan. It it was a good plan, it'd sail through. But it's not.

I reckon the vast majority realise this, its the almost complete lack of alternative that's the issue sadly.

They’re one of the main contractors for the AWPR, that stalls, then the council will delay any construction work as the transport plan will be out the window until resolved.

Its being reported that the rest of the consortium have confirmed it will be finished without Carillion, or at least that was the headline on the local news.

Surely he already has a UK permit if he's playing for Man City?

He’s been on loan in Norway, so maybe not.

Why is there nothing on the official site about this loan signing ?

Seems a little bizarre that it's all over the press but we haven't confirmed it on our own site

There was... it’s since been removed 

Still as an architect, though will need to go through the NZ registration process at some point.

Glad those crayons we packed you off with aren’t going to waste 

Have to say the afc stuff is actually quite good these days. Made sure I bought a few things before I left. Still leaving Edinburgh don to buy me an annual mug though 

If you thought the delivery fee was expensive when you were in London you’re in for a shock now 

I might bring one over as a wedding present *theres a good chance  the delivery fees are about the same as our flights though 

 

Shocker of a decision 

No much wonder Lennon was raging in his post match interview, that’s a bad one!

Would have been a great signing, can’t help but wonder if it was a case of him or may though. We only made our interest known in moult when the deal for may collapsed, didn’t we then cool our interest as may looked to become available?

It could be a case of mcinnes getting his preferred target of the two?

Had convinced myself it was time for a change, part of me still thinks it is but here’s hoping this whole experience galvanises the team and we kick on.

He MUST work on his flaws going forward though, that’s the best way to get everyone back on side.