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Main Board => Off Topic => Topic started by: SeeBass on December 11, 2018, 01:05:51 AM

Title: Who is your Sporting GOAT??????????
Post by: SeeBass on December 11, 2018, 01:05:51 AM
After Ronnie O'Sullivan became Snooker's Greatest Of All Time last night who is generally regarded as Number One Sportsperson overall in my lifetime??????????
Title: Re: Who is your Sporting GOAT??????????
Post by: Tyrant on December 11, 2018, 08:50:00 AM
Many of those options can GTF quite frankly. Ronnie O'Sullivan being amongst the first that I'd get right to fuck. Great player but by fuck he hasn't half spent his career acting the cunt. Almost as bad as that horrible cunt Alex Higgins.

I'd grudgingly accept that Roger Federer is a genuine contended for such a title. Obviously golf is shite so I rarely play or watch but by all accounts Tiger could be a genuine contender. Especially if he wins another major as that would border on miraculous.
Title: Re: Who is your Sporting GOAT??????????
Post by: BigAl on December 11, 2018, 12:11:25 PM
After Ronnie O'Sullivan became Snooker's Greatest Of All Time last night who is generally regarded as Number One Sportsperson overall in my lifetime??????????

Who the hell decided that ?
O'Sullivan wouldn't even make my top three of all time far less number one  ::)
Title: Re: Who is your Sporting GOAT??????????
Post by: RicoS321 on December 11, 2018, 12:33:46 PM
Who the hell decided that ?
O'Sullivan wouldn't even make my top three of all time far less number one  ::)

O'Sullivan wouldn't make your top three snooker players of all time? That'd be strange. I think even Stephen Hendry would grudgingly admit that Ronnie was better than him, and there was no one better than Hendry, by any objective measure.
Title: Re: Who is your Sporting GOAT??????????
Post by: Ten Caat on December 11, 2018, 12:40:19 PM
Until he equals Hendry's 7 World Championships he will forever remain second best in my book. O'Sullivan is playing in an era where there are ranking tournaments almost every single week of the year all around the world. Hendry won all his titles when IIRC there were only 10 ranking tournaments per year plus a handful of Masters tournaments (I do accept O'Sullivan only plays a limited schedule but it's at least 15 ranking tournaments in a year)

I'd concur with Federer being the greatest of all time.....his titles have been achieved when his main rivals  (Nadal and Djokovic) are possibly the 2nd/3rd greatest ever players....and even Murray has a shout at being the 4th best ever (I believe Murray at his peak would have beaten Borg/McEnroe/Connors at theirs)
Title: Re: Who is your Sporting GOAT??????????
Post by: Garlogie_Granite on December 11, 2018, 12:48:06 PM
Tiger isn't even the GOAT golfer, edit your poll for Nicklaus, Jack.
Title: Re: Who is your Sporting GOAT??????????
Post by: Garlogie_Granite on December 11, 2018, 12:49:14 PM
Bradley Wiggins far from the GOAT cyclist, and Botham likewise in cricket. Sullivan in snooker highly debatable also.
Title: Re: Who is your Sporting GOAT??????????
Post by: BigAl on December 11, 2018, 01:07:20 PM
O'Sullivan wouldn't make your top three snooker players of all time? That'd be strange. I think even Stephen Hendry would grudgingly admit that Ronnie was better than him, and there was no one better than Hendry, by any objective measure.

Ok Rico, I might be influenced by the fact I don't like the cunt.
For me, Hendry, Davis (Joe) & possibly Davis (Steve), but hey like everything else it is all about opinions.
Title: Re: Who is your Sporting GOAT??????????
Post by: RicoS321 on December 11, 2018, 01:43:09 PM
Until he equals Hendry's 7 World Championships he will forever remain second best in my book. O'Sullivan is playing in an era where there are ranking tournaments almost every single week of the year all around the world. Hendry won all his titles when IIRC there were only 10 ranking tournaments per year plus a handful of Masters tournaments (I do accept O'Sullivan only plays a limited schedule but it's at least 15 ranking tournaments in a year)

I'd concur with Federer being the greatest of all time.....his titles have been achieved when his main rivals  (Nadal and Djokovic) are possibly the 2nd/3rd greatest ever players....and even Murray has a shout at being the 4th best ever (I believe Murray at his peak would have beaten Borg/McEnroe/Connors at theirs)

O'Sullivan is also playing at a time where the players are significantly better than ever before. John Higgins is better than both Steve and his brother Joe Davis so is even the likes of Neil Robertson - even Steve Davis has said this on several occasions. The stats for 147s, centuries etc are far higher than ever before in individual tournaments at a time when the tables are getting faster and the pockets tighter (not like darts where they've increased the size of the beds #dartsConspiracy). Safety play is also significantly more accurate than in Hendry's earlier days, with long potting almost a given. You hear it in every commentary session from Taylor, Parrot etc who talk about modern players not missing long pots and so on. 

O'Sullivan's record is for most "triple crown" victories, which is just the three big tournaments where he is now ahead of Hendry, so number of tournaments is irrelevant (if anything, it's more of a hindrance). I'm sort of with you on the 7 world championships thing, but I've heard Hendry even acknowledge that he thinks Ronnie is a better player than he was, which is good enough for me. It's tight between them, but they're both miles ahead of anyone else to have played the game. I've always backed Hendry as the best but only because he's Scottish and I'm clearly biased - taking that aside, I think O'Sullivan edges it. A 147 in 5 minutes and centuries in actual competitive matches with your wrong hand is something beyond that which any other has done in the sport.

Ok Rico, I might be influenced by the fact I don't like the cunt.
For me, Hendry, Davis (Joe) & possibly Davis (Steve), but hey like everything else it is all about opinions.

I don't think it is about opinions though really. The stats are very very clear (certainly that he's better than anyone but Hendry). Your or my opinion doesn't trump those facts. Especially in snooker when you play yourself as much as your opponent.

 
Title: Re: Who is your Sporting GOAT??????????
Post by: kiriakovisthenewstrachan on December 11, 2018, 01:47:04 PM
I both love and hate these things.  Great to compare people from different sports/eras but at the same time, very difficult to, if that makes sense.  Cannot see how anyone who has not seen any of the past greats in their prime can really say how good they were, eg. Joe Davis.

For what it's worth, I think John Higgins would be pretty near the top in the snooker world if you were to ask most of the experts.

Title: Re: Who is your Sporting GOAT??????????
Post by: Kowalski on December 11, 2018, 02:27:49 PM
Haven’t bothered to vote. Dodgy poll.

Hendry over O’Sullivan every day.

Not convinced Hamilton or Farah are the best there has been in their sports. Far from it. Same for Tiger and Wiggins FFS.

Almost impossible to pick. Federer is up there though (grudgingly too!).
Would have been better to try a British or Scottish sporting GOAT.
Title: Re: Who is your Sporting GOAT??????????
Post by: RicoS321 on December 11, 2018, 03:12:40 PM
I both love and hate these things.  Great to compare people from different sports/eras but at the same time, very difficult to, if that makes sense.  Cannot see how anyone who has not seen any of the past greats in their prime can really say how good they were, eg. Joe Davis.

For what it's worth, I think John Higgins would be pretty near the top in the snooker world if you were to ask most of the experts.

I think snooker is completely different, and very easy to compare, similarly with golf or other individual sports that involve a scoring system. I don't need to have seen Joe Davis to know that he wasn't better than O'Sullivan or Hendry, the scores are there for everyone to see. O'Sullivan and Hendry both having far greater century counts and not in tables with giant pooches. Cheating Joe Davis fuck. He didn't even get to the crucible, the deed fuck.
Title: Re: Who is your Sporting GOAT??????????
Post by: BigAl on December 11, 2018, 03:27:43 PM
I think snooker is completely different, and very easy to compare, similarly with golf or other individual sports that involve a scoring system. I don't need to have seen Joe Davis to know that he wasn't better than O'Sullivan or Hendry, the scores are there for everyone to see. O'Sullivan and Hendry both having far greater century counts and not in tables with giant pooches. Cheating Joe Davis fuck. He didn't even get to the crucible, the deed fuck.

" Coinciding with his peak as a billiards player, Davis's interests shifted to snooker and he helped to organise the first snooker world championship in 1927 and won the tournament by beating Tom Dennis, for which he won UK£6 10s.He went on to win the world championship every year until 1940. Joe's brother Fred, twelve years his junior, was also a snooker player and multiple World Champion. When Joe met Fred in the world championship final of 1940, Joe won 37–36.

Following the outbreak of World War II the world championship was not held for the next five years. On resumption in 1946, Davis defended his title making it his 15th consecutive win and thereby holding the title for 20 straight years. To date, he has won more world championships than any other player. He retired from the event following this victory making him the only undefeated player in the history of the world championships."

Fifteen yes FIFTEEN consecutive titles and never defeated in World Championship.
As they say in life you can only beat what is put in front of you or piss with the cock you're born with. Hardly his fault the Ronnie O'sullivan didn't come along until later. I'm still putting Joe ahead of The Rocket a man who disrespected the sport that earned him a fortune
Title: Re: Who is your Sporting GOAT??????????
Post by: SeeBass on December 11, 2018, 03:45:27 PM
Guys I wasn't meaning for the option in this Poll to be taken seriously.  As one said they are just people who might be considered as being best within their chosen career during my 30 years watching sport.  Always wondered whether given Sports Personality Of The Year this Sunday evening whether folk actually believe Snooker, Darts, Horse Racing, Cycling and Mixed Martial Arts are a valid nomination for somebody from that background to be included in such a list.   
Title: Re: Who is your Sporting GOAT??????????
Post by: wee toon red on December 11, 2018, 04:05:36 PM
In terms of who is the greatest in any sport, I'd agree with those who say it's very difficult to compare different players from different eras.

One thing that I think does separate certain individuals is whether they've actually contributed to major changes in their sport. For example, in snooker, Stephen Hendry pretty much paved the way for the modern game by making long potting something to be attempted rather than avoided. Until Hendry came on the scene, snooker was very safety led and then he arrived taking on and potting anything in sight. Does that make him better than O'Sullivan? Maybe not but I think it should be a big factor. You can also say the same for Tiger; he pretty much led the way in aggressive, attacking, long-driving golf. Again, does it make him better than Nicklaus? Debatable but a consideration.
Title: Re: Who is your Sporting GOAT??????????
Post by: Kowalski on December 11, 2018, 04:06:47 PM
Lewis Hamilton is very good but F1 is a sham these days.  Winning titles doesn’t make you the greatest, especially when there is a huge reliance on the car.
My old man has lived through all the champs post-Fangio (he’s not THAT old) and he says Jim Clark was the best. And that’ll do for me wrt F1.
Title: Re: Who is your Sporting GOAT??????????
Post by: Madbadteacher on December 11, 2018, 04:08:23 PM
Jack Nicklaus
Mohammed Ali
Bernard Hinault
Don Bradman
Bjorn Borg

To name but a few.....
Title: Re: Who is your Sporting GOAT??????????
Post by: KennyFuckinPowers on December 11, 2018, 04:17:22 PM
Many of those options can GTF quite frankly. Ronnie O'Sullivan being amongst the first that I'd get right to fuck. Great player but by fuck he hasn't half spent his career acting the cunt. Almost as bad as that horrible cunt Alex Higgins.

I'd grudgingly accept that Roger Federer is a genuine contended for such a title. Obviously golf is shite so I rarely play or watch but by all accounts Tiger could be a genuine contender. Especially if he wins another major as that would border on miraculous.

 :surprised: Why do you think that of Alex Higgins? Exceptionally talented man who just let his personal problems get in the way of his career, lots of people have done that. Had he managed to contain his personal demons, he'd have won more than he did. Seemed like a good cunt to me, was also shafted by that cunt Hearn, who was paying for people like Davis, Reardon, Hendry etc.. .to be chauffeured around while making Higgins take Public Transport. There was a very good documentary on him recently, I thought it was enjoyable.
Title: Re: Who is your Sporting GOAT??????????
Post by: CtS on December 11, 2018, 05:29:25 PM
Seve. That’s all.
Title: Re: Who is your Sporting GOAT??????????
Post by: Tyrant on December 12, 2018, 09:49:38 AM
:surprised: Why do you think that of Alex Higgins? Exceptionally talented man who just let his personal problems get in the way of his career, lots of people have done that. Had he managed to contain his personal demons, he'd have won more than he did. Seemed like a good cunt to me, was also shafted by that cunt Hearn, who was paying for people like Davis, Reardon, Hendry etc.. .to be chauffeured around while making Higgins take Public Transport. There was a very good documentary on him recently, I thought it was enjoyable.

I read Stephen Hendry's autobiography recently which lifted the lid on some of the shit he'd say to follow pros. Then there's the fact he was banned multiple times for various assaults and death threats. Clearly unable to control his emotions to the detriment of those around him. But worst of all... Hun.
Title: Re: Who is your Sporting GOAT??????????
Post by: Ten Caat on December 12, 2018, 10:14:07 AM
Aye Higgins was a wife beater and I'm sure issued a death threat to Dennis Taylor in the 80s. Cretin of a human being, undeniably a genius on occasion but ruined his life and health with alcohol and smoking.
Title: Re: Who is your Sporting GOAT??????????
Post by: Garlogie_Granite on December 12, 2018, 11:43:53 AM
Guys I wasn't meaning for the option in this Poll to be taken seriously.  As one said they are just people who might be considered as being best within their chosen career during my 30 years watching sport.  Always wondered whether given Sports Personality Of The Year this Sunday evening whether folk actually believe Snooker, Darts, Horse Racing, Cycling and Mixed Martial Arts are a valid nomination for somebody from that background to be included in such a list.
Erm yes, the fact they often get overlooked is more of an issue. The year Hamilton won it was an utter joke, not sure if that was the Rory year, anyway, SPOTY is a farce now.
Title: Re: Who is your Sporting GOAT??????????
Post by: RicoS321 on December 12, 2018, 02:16:35 PM
The year Hamilton won it was an utter joke,

Exactly. Fucking plastic pitch cunts.
Title: Re: Who is your Sporting GOAT??????????
Post by: KennyFuckinPowers on December 12, 2018, 04:55:08 PM
I read Stephen Hendry's autobiography recently which lifted the lid on some of the shit he'd say to follow pros. Then there's the fact he was banned multiple times for various assaults and death threats. Clearly unable to control his emotions to the detriment of those around him. But worst of all... Hun.

Aye, I mind watching an interview with Hendry, when Higgins was still around and playing, and he was spitting the dummy saying he wasn't participating in a certain event ( Can't remember the event ) if Higgins was. A few of the players had the same attitude as Hendry regarding that event. His Football affiliation has zero bearing on me, I genuinely never knew he was a Hun, just knew him through Snooker his his well documented off table personal issues. I just think he ruined himself with his drinking & Drugs, and struggled to cope with the way Snooker was progressing under Hearn, lots of rule changes and being under the spotlight even more.

His kid and ex-wife still hold him in a positive light, so perhaps they understood what he was going through, of course, that doesn't make assaulting a woman acceptable, but she seemed to still have love for him, plenty of interviews and the like to suggest so. And here is Hendry, with a snippet from that autobiography, angry at a few of his fellow pro's for not attending Higgins' funeral.

https://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/sunday-life/stephen-hendry-reveals-alex-higgins-threatened-to-live-in-a-caravan-in-his-garden-harebrained-but-harmless-that-was-higgy-37305880.html
Title: Re: Who is your Sporting GOAT??????????
Post by: donsdaft on December 15, 2018, 03:06:13 PM
I nearly had a fight with him once but we were both too pished to take a swing at each other.
Title: Re: Who is your Sporting GOAT??????????
Post by: tlg1903 on December 15, 2018, 04:27:52 PM
I would still say Henry is the greatest of all time for the 7 world titles.  I don't like ROS as person very much but I adore watching him play.  Imo he is the most naturally talented player so far and if he had Hendry or Davis temperament he would have eclipsed them long ago.

Would love to see mid 90's Hendry up against modern day ROS, that would be a hell of a match.
Title: Re: Who is your Sporting GOAT??????????
Post by: tom_widdows on December 19, 2018, 08:12:19 PM
Id suggest replacing Ian Botham with Don Bradman

I also question having Hamilton instead of Senna or Schumacher
Title: Re: Who is your Sporting GOAT??????????
Post by: kiriakovisthenewstrachan on May 07, 2019, 08:50:46 AM
Noticed recently there seems to be a real obsession in mentioning that someone is the best player of all time whenever a sporting event is on the box.

Cannot seem to watch a fitba match involving Messi without them eluding to it and it happened numerous times during the Masters golf the other week.  But the snooker, these last two weeks, bloody hell...........seemed like every time they cut to the studio, whether it was BBC or Eurosport they insisted on blowing smoke up someone's arse whether it was Davis, Hendry, O'Sullivan or Higgins.  Every line seemed to be "if he's not the best of all time, certainly in the top two or three".

Even Hazel Irvine was at pains to point out that it was the greatest final of all time.  Don't know if she noticed one player won by 9 frames so it wasn't exactly gripping viewing.  The quality of play was not in doubt but there have been easily at least half a dozen better finals.

Gary Neville and Carragher were at it last night as well saying Kompany, Aguero and Silva must be Man City's best three players ever.  Did they even see any of their games pre 1990 to be able to judge?